The 3G network will be shutting down in Manitoba

[Peggie29]

I just received a text warning me that my device will no longer work on the Public Mobile Network after 3G is shut down in Manitoba, which is supposed to start happening in most areas December 31, 2025... and that I should switch to Telus (no thanks). 

Can someone explain to me why this is so, when I have a Samsung s9+ that supports 4G/LTE - or link me to the appropriate community article that explains it?

[disallow21]

Ulefone Note 18 Ultra 5G is shown as supported using the IMEI tool.  Under $200, my daughter has been using it for a year.  My wife's Ulefone X13 also seems to be fine for VoLTE, but doe not show as supported.

[DanaB]

My S10e is unsupported according to the IMEI Lookup for Public Mobile, but it is supported by Telus and KODOO. I have reached out to customer support to see what they have to say on the topic and I'll update you all here when I find out.

[Peggie29]

Just to add to this. My phone Will do voLTE. It's a combination of regional firmware and carrier locks that prevent it from doing it during calls.

I see people getting S7 phones working in Australia after they turned off 3G in that country, by flashing generic firmware/setting their carrier code. S7s are super old phones.

Similar results in the US with various phones.

I've got a spare s9+ and will probably try that for myself.

[hTideGnow]

hi @Peggie29 

3G is going to be dropped across Canada, you’ll need a VoLTE capable device with all carriers. 

you might see it unfair that PM does not include some of the older Android phones.  But unlike iPhone, there are just too many Android phones and not all carriers can guarantee older Android phones will work with the new network standard

And add to @sheytoon's note above, since you are using a Samsung, you might see it showing LTE before you make a call and the network change to 4G.  If you see it change to 4G, it is in fact 3G and it means it is not using VoLTE.  (yes, Samsung has a different network label, 4G is in fact 3G, only LTE means 4G)

[sheytoon]

@wg007again look at your signal bars at the top of your phone. Before you make a call it will say 4G/LTE or 5G.

During a call it might change to 3G.

Disconnect from wifi so you can see the network type easily.

[softech]

@wg007again 

What you see now is pretty much done.  From what we understand, Public Mobile is not adding older phones on list, certainly not phones that are 6 years old.  

[wg007again]

What I'm confused about are several posters here saying things like: "However, Public Mobile hasn't updated their VoLTE list in years and seriously needs to upgrade it no matter how many times they are asked to do so by customers," or "Here's a list but it's still evolving." At what point do I know the IMEI checker is final and valid?

I checked the IMEI before posting but other Internet sources seem to suggest there's no reason it shouldn't be compatible and you mentioned A50 has VoLTE too so... is it just PM that's decided my phone won't work anymore? Can I take it to a different provider and have it be fine? If so, that's shady af imho. Why wouldn't PM want me to stay with them, and just whitelist my phone if it's VoLTE capable?

Like I said, all this tech stuff is over my head but it just doesn't feel like cool business practices if my phone has VoLTE but PM just decides it's not whitelisted?!? I don't get it.

Also I was asking where you can tell if your phone is using 4G when you're on a call. Want to answer that? "but where am I looking in terms of "When you make a call and you look at the phone WHILE you're in the call...  does it say 3G or 4G?" Thanks!"

[softech]

@wg007again 

While A50 has VoLTE, but it is not whitelisted with PM. You would be impacted by the 3G shutdown in Manitoba and you should start shopping for a new phone.  A50 was released back in July 2019, so it is a 6 years old phone and it is not a bad time to get a new one anyway

You can also check if your phone is VoLTE compatible using the IMEI check here:
https://www.publicmobile.ca/en/on/get-help/articles/volte

[wg007again]

Hey there!

Trying to figure out if my phone is compatible (Samsung A50) or if I'll need to replace it, and unfortunately a lot of the technical messages in this thread are a little over my head. Your note about "Public Mobile hasn't updated their VoLTE list in years and seriously needs to upgrade it" gave me some relief...

When I look under Mobile Networks, there's no VoLTE option but there is LTE which I sort of thought was 4G but what do I know?

I am intrigued by your final question but where am I looking in terms of "When you make a call and you look at the phone WHILE you're in the call...  does it say 3G or 4G?" Thanks!

[Banni13]

Thank-you!!! I've been looking everywhere for this!

[slusagm]

they removed the list , but here you are:

• Apple iPhone 8 & above (iOS 16 & above)
• Google Pixel 4/4XL/4a/4a 5G (TP1A.220624.014 & above)
• Google Pixel 5 (TP1A.220624.014 & above)
• Google Pixel 6a (TP1A.220624.021.A1 & above)
• Google Pixel 6/6 Pro (TP1A.220624.021 & above)
• Google Pixel 7/7 Pro (TD1A.220804.009.A2 & above)
• Samsung S23 (AVK2 & above)
• Samsung S22/S22+/S22 Ultra (CWAI & above)
• Samsung Galaxy Z Flip4 & Fold4 (CWAC & above)
• Samsung Galaxy Z Flip3 5G & Fold3 5G (FWB1 & above)
• Samsung Galaxy Z Flip 5G (HWB1 & above)
• Samsung Galaxy Z Fold2 5G (JWB5 & above)
• Samsung Note20 5G/Ultra 5G (HWB3& above)
• Samsung A53 5G (CWB4 & above)
• Samsung S21 FE 5G (EWB3 & above)
• Motorola edge 2022 (S2ST32.71-71 & above)
• Motorola Moto g 5G (S2SA32.1-54 & above)
• Motorola Moto g power (2022) (S3RQ32.20-42-10 & above)
• Motorola Moto g pure (S3RH32.20-42-10 & above)
• Motorola Moto g stylus 5G (2022) (S2SD32.21-85-3 & above)
• TCL 303 (V9Q1K & above)
• TCL 30 XE 5G (DM9M & above)
• TCL 20s (9DI0 & above)
• TCL 30 5G (7FCU & above)
• Sonim XP10 Rugged Phone (10.0.0-01-12.0.0-12.25.10 & above)
• ZTA Blade A7P (Z6252CAV1.0.0B15 & above)

[disallow21]

There is no link to the approved list at the bottom of that page...

[will13am]

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@softech wrote:

@will13am 

The lack of 5G is a known issue that S20 series does not work well with PM or Koodo, mainly because it was blocked on the OS level, an agreement between Telus and Samsung because both Koodo and PM did not have 5G support when S20 was introduced.  Yes, PM and Koodo both supporting 5G but it is too late and Samsung no longer update the OS to allow the phone to use 5G on PM

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I get the finger pointing exercise.  

[softech]

I think the whitelist is not necessarily with Telus, but certainly still with Public

[sheytoon]

If that's the case, then Telus must still be using their so called whitelist, which is very unfortunate.

[will13am]

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@sheytoon wrote:

Seems like Rogers is shutting down 3G in Manitoba, and Bell is going along with it. That affects Telus customers in rural areas, timeline is end of 2025.

Urban MB has a separate Telus RAN with 3G 1900, which Telus plans to decommission by March 2026.

Outside of MB, Bell and Telus have started 3G 850 refarming, but they have no plans to remove 3G 1900 at this time. 

@will13am that's mostly because of phone software. For VoLTE, there may have been a network whitelist in the past, but afaik that is not used any more on Telus. 5G access wouldn't be impacted by any whitelist. 

For VoLTE to work, a phone needs to establish a network bearer with ims APN, and then send an IMS registration request to the (IMS core) network to initiate the procedure. The problematic phones are not doing that. No changes on the network can fix this. It's a phone software issue.

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@sheytoon , how do you explain the fact that immediately upon VoLTE rollout on this platform, it was working fine on my Umidigi A13 pro.  The hidden menu was showing successful IMS registration.  That lasted for about 2ish months and then I lost VoLTE.  This spring, VoLTE came back.  During the time that I had no VoLTE, there were no software updates on the phone that could have interfered with VoLTE.  I cannot help but think that something was happening on the network side to deny access.  

[softech]

@will13am 

The lack of 5G is a known issue that S20 series does not work well with PM or Koodo, mainly because it was blocked on the OS level, an agreement between Telus and Samsung because both Koodo and PM did not have 5G support when S20 was introduced.  Yes, PM and Koodo both supporting 5G but it is too late and Samsung no longer update the OS to allow the phone to use 5G on PM

[sheytoon]

Seems like Rogers is shutting down 3G in Manitoba, and Bell is going along with it. That affects Telus customers in rural areas, timeline is end of 2025.

Urban MB has a separate Telus RAN with 3G 1900, which Telus plans to decommission by March 2026.

Outside of MB, Bell and Telus have started 3G 850 refarming, but they have no plans to remove 3G 1900 at this time. 

@will13am that's mostly because of phone software. For VoLTE, there may have been a network whitelist in the past, but afaik that is not used any more on Telus. 5G access wouldn't be impacted by any whitelist. 

For VoLTE to work, a phone needs to establish a network bearer with ims APN, and then send an IMS registration request to the (IMS core) network to initiate the procedure. The problematic phones are not doing that. No changes on the network can fix this. It's a phone software issue.

[computergeek541]

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@will13am wrote:

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@sheytoon , can you shed some technical insights into why hardware that appears to be VoLTE capable are not able to work with certain carrier brands.  Ditto with 5G.  I have a S20 FE 5G that was purchased from Public Mobile when they were selling pre-owned hardware and I don't get 5G but VoLTE works.  I have a Umidigi phone that had VoLTE when it first rolled out on this service and then it was denied VoLTE access for a long time and recently VoLTE capability was restored.  It would seem to me that there is something unholy going on.  

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I suspect that the lack of 5G on your Samsung Galaxy S20 FE has to do with Samsung's carrier software customization.  There is another issue though.  Public Mobile sold that phone directly to customers and advertised specifically as a 5G device and should take responsibility for that.  As for your Umidigi device, I highly doubt that it was any device software update that made your device suddenly start working again on VoLTE but rather a change in the way that the network is granting access to devices.

[will13am]

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@sheytoon wrote:

@hTideGnow not that I know of. Telus doesn't have 850 licenses in Manitoba. But I'm not familiar with MB plans in general.

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@sheytoon , can you shed some technical insights into why hardware that appears to be VoLTE capable are not able to work with certain carrier brands.  Ditto with 5G.  I have a S20 FE 5G that was purchased from Public Mobile when they were selling pre-owned hardware and I don't get 5G but VoLTE works.  I have a Umidigi phone that had VoLTE when it first rolled out on this service and then it was denied VoLTE access for a long time and recently VoLTE capability was restored.  It would seem to me that there is something unholy going on.  

[dougc]

The newbie PM management,  sure seem to be  downgrading  our PM services, while increasing  costs  !!?   

[dougc]

Yeeech,   so when I finally make it back home' for an overdue visit, my alleged  smartie'phone will be un-usable !?!

And  I have been eyeballing an upgrade, which would ah been 5G  unit !   Yowser !!      LoL

[BKNS27]

@sheytoon 

That is strange, I see it on my Samsung S9.

 

[sheytoon]

@hTideGnow not that I know of. Telus doesn't have 850 licenses in Manitoba. But I'm not familiar with MB plans in general.

[umnikke8]

Telus and Bell also announcing the same thing. Since Public & Telus customers in MB use Bell's network in rural areas and Telus's for the cities.

https://www.telus.com/en/support/article/3g-shutdown-manitoba

https://support.bell.ca/mobility/network_coverage/hspa_network 

[computergeek541]

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@williamb wrote:

My wife got the same message today, she has an S10e, when she is on a call it says 4G. When not on a call it says LTE. Sounds like it will be fine. Thanks!

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It won't be fine.  When a phone switches from LTE to 4G during a phone call, this means that the device isn't using VoLTE for that call.  4G in this case actually means a HSPA/3G network.  Many phones show 4G when it is actually a 3G network.  This is due to a marketing concept that was used by several cell phone carriers to rename what was always known as the 3G network to 4G.

[umnikke8]

Help article about it

https://publicmobile.ca/en/get-help/articles/3g-shutdown 

[hTideGnow]

hi @williamb 

Samsung is weird, when it shows 4G, it is actually using 3G , only if it shows LTE means 4G

would I change phone ?  I wouldn't rush.  From what we understand, they are only shutting down one of the 2 bands (850) and still have the other one working. For most of us, that one band is enough

so, wait till you really have trouble with calls.  

But of course, S10 is a 5 years phone and no more security update, it is not bad an idea to shop for a new phone anyway

[williamb]

so back to the original posters question - does the phone need to be replaced?
When on calls it shows 4G.

[hTideGnow]

hi @williamb 

it is normal the VoLTE not there, PM hides it

but S10 is not compatible with PM's VoLTE, so, the VoLTE toggle is turned off by the carrier and you cannot turn it on