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Why price increase on few existing grandfathered $10 plans.

Beer
Town Hero / Héro de la Ville

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44 REPLIES 44

darlicious
Mayor / Maire

@ShawnC13 

I'm not debating "the chance" of a $0 bill per se.... I'm pointing out that once you achieve the result the provider can pull the rug out from under you meaning that the customer can overcome "the chance" claim but the provider by its use of the terms of service can and will prevent you from overcoming that burden once it's achieved.

 

The advertising contends "the chance" by putting the burden on the customer to achieve the goal of a $0 bill. We know that 99.99% or more customers will never achieve that result. As does the provider which is the beauty of the marketing of this advertising. It achieves the result of gaining customers like myself when choosing providers. The main focus being saving money on the cost of your mobility service by paying the lowest possible bill.  So what was the discerning factor in choosing public mobile over chatr or lucky given their pricing is nearly identical on the surface? Rewards. Like the lottery "the chance" is a powerful motivator in choosing in this case where you will spend your money (vs if) and was hands down the deciding factor for me in choosing public mobile as my provider.

 

Now as you may know there was a significant burden upon me "the customer" to achieve "the chance" of a $0 bill given the fact that as a neophyte on mobility and self described as technologically challenged choosing public mobile in order to save money on my mobility services over chatr or lucky and on one of my two accounts....specifically the account moved from freedom that would still have the grandfathered $40/month unlimited everything plan meant giving up a call centre both with the freedom account and my telus account. The telus account meant immediate savings by changing provider's but the freedom account by giving up the unlimited data but for my usage getting an equal plan with public mobile for the same price the only way to save money was making use of the claim "the chance" to get my bill down to $0. That started immediately by reducing it $2 with the autopay reward.

 

It took some work and a fair bit of learning from the community to get my $10 plan down to a "0" bill but I did it by the end of my second month with public mobile. Then I started to work on my second "main" account that while it remained on the $40 plan with a $10 discount for quite awhile once that was finished it was changed to the $15 plan because I discovered like many customers that with no overages, extra billing or fees with public mobile there is no need to overbuy features out of fear of "bill shock". But once a year rolled around and my first loyalty rewards were kicking the second account hit the "$0"  bill mark....give or take a suspended account or two by my referrals.

 

Now was it "chance" or "luck" that I got my bill down to "$0"? I think not. Sure when taking the entire subscribership as whole then generally a customer has a "chance" at lowering  their bill t o $0. Give  a customer the tools, the knowledge base and the motivation to lower their bill to "$0"  as well. They just arent motivated enough or have the need for to a "$0" bill. To compare it to winning the lottery which commonly has 1 in 14,000,000  chance of winning to which the customer has no influence or control over (nor should they) the outcome other than "being in it to win it" is completely and fully a short sighted glib remark.

 

A far better comparison would be the concept of a data add on by most other provider's that I have always found laughable. The opportunity to purchase "add on" data usually near the end of your billing period when you are running out of your plan data. Relatively expensive but a lot cheaper than overage data. However this add on data rolls over to charge you again if it's not cancelled before your next billing period begins.....which defeats it's definition and purpose.  Why would a customer even know they would need an add on before their billing period even begins? And if they did why would they purchase an expensive data add on when they can choose to increase their much cheaper plan data allotment instead?

hTideGnow
Mayor / Maire

If "a chance to " is a false advertisement, then all Lottery corporations are in deep trouble  🤣

 

I think it is time to let this topic ends, at least on the Community.  There is no point to keep brining it up.  If complains are made to the proper organizations, just be patience and wait for the fair judgement.   

 

ShawnC13
Oracle
Oracle

@darlicious, I totally understand your frustration.  This doesn't say you will get your bill down to $0, it says there is a chance of that happening.  If that is bait and switch then everyone should be going after all the Lottery Corporations for a chance to become a Millionaire

 


I am happy to help, but I am not a Customer Support Agent please do not include any personal info in a message to me. Click HERE to create a trouble ticket through SIMon the Chatbot *

darlicious
Mayor / Maire

@ShawnC13 

Not if they keep raising the price of your plan..... false and misleading advertising practices. Every time you get to $0 they come along and hit you with another price hike. The old bait and switch.

 

Bait and switch

section 74.04

Bait and switch selling is when a product is advertised at a “bargain price” but the product is not available for sale in reasonable quantities.

 

Screenshot_20220327-013033~2.png

 

False or misleading representationssection 52 and paragraph 74.01(1)(a) It is against the law to make materially false or misleading representations to promote a product, service or business interest. A representation is “material” if the general impression it conveys leads someone to take a particular course of action, like buying or using a product or service. A “representation” refers to any marketing material, including online and in-store advertisements, direct mail, social media messages, promotional emails, and endorsements, among other things.

 

Screenshot_20220328-093406~3.png.

To contact customer support : Submit a support ticket via SIMon the chat bot Click here 

Or if you cannot submit a ticket via SIMon then Click here   ....for additional member supplied info.

@darlicious that can be for any plan if someone is on the old rewards system

 


I am happy to help, but I am not a Customer Support Agent please do not include any personal info in a message to me. Click HERE to create a trouble ticket through SIMon the Chatbot *

darlicious
Mayor / Maire

@ShawnC13 

I remembered I had an answer to your question earlier in this thread about pm advertising the price of the plan being $3? Lucky for you I have long forgotten my diatribe to go with the screenshot....

 

Screenshot_20220328-093406~2.png

 

 

 

To contact customer support : Submit a support ticket via SIMon the chat bot Click here 

Or if you cannot submit a ticket via SIMon then Click here   ....for additional member supplied info.

@Beer 

Lol...I was confusing today's date trying to figure out the glitch in your payment date?!! Looks like you redeemed those points just in time.

 

 

 

 

To contact customer support click below:

https://productioncommunity.publicmobile.ca/t5/notes/composepage/note-to-user-id/22437

To pre-verify your account include your full name, address, email, phone # and 4 digit acct pin #.

@Beer i think the price increase starts on April 28, you just made one more cycle before the new price

dabr
Mayor / Maire

@Beer   Nope, confirmed by CSA.   It does seem, however, that not everyone is receiving the notice at the same time.

 

Edit:  The price increase takes effect from April, 28th/2022.

 

Edit:  Sorry, but didn't you post originally asking if the increase for the grandfathered plan was only applicable for some customers only?  Because my first sentence was responding to that question...

Beer
Town Hero / Héro de la Ville

I have just made a $10 monthly payment and it shows that my next payment of $10 is due  on April 26. No where is there a mention of a price increase.  😀😀😀

 

  • Available Funds: $5.00
  • Payment Due Before: Apr 26, 2022
  • Payment for Next Cycle: $10.00
  • Amount Owing: $5.00

darlicious
Mayor / Maire

@Beer 

Pm won't release those kind of statistics. They don't even release their subscribership numbers. But if you want a rough estimate and given that the demographic of the $10 50/50 plan is probably 25% children and 25% seniors both of whom by nature of their plan are unlikely to post on the community. The other 50% of $10 plan holders probably have the average habits and participation as any other public mobile customer. So if you take the following statistics into account:

 

  1. There are approximately 230,000 community member accounts.
  2. Estimated subscribership has been 500,000+ public mobile customers.
  3. Approximately half of public mobile customers have joined the community.
  4. There have been just under 47,000 topics started by members posting at least once.
  5. Just over 47,000 members have replied at least once to a topic started.
  6.  Given those numbers it's safe to say 1/5 or 20% of members have sought help directly from the community for an issue or felt the need to comment on the forum.
  7. Almost 29,000 members have earned a bravo and nearly 24,000 have given a bravo.
  8. Half who have posted have given and received a bravo but only 8% have accepted a solution.
  9. 10% of these members hang around enough to have posted, replied or bravoed between 5 and 25 times or at most 2% of community members and 1% of total customers.
  10. Only 0.1%or less have contributed enough to earn a rewards in any one possible month.

Given the the statistics of all customers and community members above we can determine from the following numbers on posts and threads that about the $10 50/50 plan :

 

  1. In the past 3 years about 75 different members have posted or replied in threads with the subject or topic being the $10 50/50 plan indicating they are $10 plan holders.
  2. The recent proposed 30% rate hike of a $3 price increase to the $10 plan changing it to $13/30days motivated concerned members to start 16 different threads questioning the emails and texts recieved by plan holders or their family members.
  3. 25 different members posted or replied in these threads identifying themselves as being subscribers to the $10 plan.
  4. 25 members are confirmed $10 plan holders and represent 2% of community members with up to 75 members historically representing 2% of members subscribed to this plan.
  5. Between 1250 and 3250 community members have the $10 plan leading to an estimate of between 2500 and 6500 total customers currently subscribed to the $10 50/50 plan and affected by the 30% rate hike.

Telus thru public mobile's current subscribers of the $10 plan would earn an additional monthly profit of $7500 up to $19,500 by the $3 rate hike or between $90,000 and $234,000 per year. Given that telus made a net profit of $663 million last year is it really worth it to them to affect their mobile customer churn rate of less than 1% and their industry leading customer satisfaction rating to increase their bottom line profitability by a mere 0.0166% to 0.0333% on the backs of loyal customers who can least afford such an unjustifiable and unreasonable 30% rate hike tariff to the most basic of mobile plans. 

 

Has telus forgotten that it's their loyal customer base that has fueled their successful growth and profitability which allows them to pay out a healthy return on investment to their shareholders? It's that very lack of loyalty and customer satisfaction at their main competitors that has driven telus's gain in new mobile subscribers of nearly 1 million last year alone. Is $3 enough of a reward to risk their reputation? Time will tell....telus....time will tell.

 

 

 

 

To contact customer support click below:

https://productioncommunity.publicmobile.ca/t5/notes/composepage/note-to-user-id/22437

To pre-verify your account include your full name, address, email, phone # and 4 digit acct pin #.

paprika
Good Citizen / Bon Citoyen

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Beer
Town Hero / Héro de la Ville

@paprika wrote:

@Beer wrote:

 I don't imagine that there are many active $10 plans.  Is there a way we can get the number of active $10 plans from PM?

Other than conducting a poll / survey, we don't have access to this information. And, not every $10 plan customer has created a user account and is active in the Community (this forum).


Obviously PM has this information and I don't see how that may be confidential ---- perhaps an Oracle or PM agent would access this info.

paprika
Good Citizen / Bon Citoyen

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Beer
Town Hero / Héro de la Ville

@ShawnC13 wrote:

@Beer what do you consider a few people on those plans? 10-20, or 1000-2000?  As consumers, we always hope that a provider or retailer will supply an item that will suit our needs and the price we want to pay when in actuality we need to consider what we are willing to pay for what we need from them.


 

Beer
Town Hero / Héro de la Ville

@ShawnC13 wrote:

@Beer what do you consider a few people on those plans? 10-20, or 1000-2000?  As consumers, we always hope that a provider or retailer will supply an item that will suit our needs and the price we want to pay when in actuality we need to consider what we are willing to pay for what we need from them.


I don't imagine that there would be many active $10 plans. Is there a way to get this info from PM?

paprika
Good Citizen / Bon Citoyen

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darlicious
Mayor / Maire

@ShawnC13 

Well that's one of the many differences between you and me (not that there is anything wrong with that). But I am not willing to shrug my shoulders in compliance and accept an edict when its not reasonably justified. With nearly all mobile plan prices decreasing in price by 25% alone in the past two years across the industry it's unacceptable to raise the price of the $10 plan by 30%.

 

European basic plan prices with unlimited texts/calls and an average 3gb of data are priced between $8 and $12 per 30 days for prepaid plans and even less for postpaid plans and almost all include free EU roaming (a few UK plans are the exception.)

 

It just surprises me how so many will complain about the big three, our lack of competition in the telecommunications industry and the prices we pay for our mobile services compared to the rest of the world but when there is an opportunity to take our collective provider to task not only can most not be bothered because it doesn't affect their own plans but they defend the very provider that they complained about the moment before?!! 

 

With the approval in principle of the Rogers take over of Shaw Communications the competition in this industry just shrank considerably and a greedy red giant just grew by leaps and bounds to assert even more dominance over consumers and eventually swallow up two mid level mobile providers who helped shake up the Canadian industry and force the big three to offer tiered providers with plans and prices that almost every member of our society could afford based on need.....from the grand kiddies texting for their ride home from soccer practise to their great grandparent in pandemic lockdown at the nursing home getting their twice weekly call from a loved one that gave them hope that it wouldn't last forever....or at least their forever.

 

Rogers has convinced the CRTC that the merge will be good for the industry giving consumers more choice(?) with the expansion of the 5G network which is primarily for business and those with more money than sense. Their lofty goals of expanding coverage to the more remote areas of this country under the guise of expanding coverage for indigenous communities is simply monopolizing communications for isolated societies and unless rogers is agreeing to heavily subsidize their rates the average family won't be able to afford to be connected to the expanded network.

 

If telus goes forward with raising the basic $10 50/50 plan to $13 With both their customers and public mobiles it will leave only Shaw (soon to disappear I'm sure) with its free, $5 and $10 plans tied to a customers home services plans, ICE mobile's $9 plan limited to the North only, Sasktel's $10 plan and a mishmash of pay-per-use plans from Speak out ( minimum $25) and freedom and telus's $100/year 400/400 plans whose upfront costs are out of reach for many low income and fixed income customers.

 

While a $3 price hike seems small to many who have commented that affected customers should just switch to the $15 plan because you get so much more for your money....that then represents a 50% plan cost increase for customers who got by just fine on the limited $10 plan. When you live in bc with the highest cost of living in the country to go with the recently raised social assistance rates that are also the highest in Canada.....

 

$935/month for single person expected to look for work 5 days a week with no other supports or a single parent with teenager receiving $1270/month who may or may not have subsidized housing at $570 leaving $700 to pay for everything else makes an extra $3 or $5 ×2 per month a challenge. Skip the weekly laundry to twice a month? Go back to the rag? Rather than splurge feminine hygiene products? Stop taking the pill? Buy one 4 l jug of milk of milk per month instead of two?

 

These are the choices low income customers will have to make if they choose to stay connected to the telus mobile network if telus doesn't reverse its decision to this 30% rate hike on the $10 plan.

 

 

 

 

To contact customer support click below:

https://productioncommunity.publicmobile.ca/t5/notes/composepage/note-to-user-id/22437

To pre-verify your account include your full name, address, email, phone # and 4 digit acct pin #.

@darlicious, I didn't file a CCTS complaint for that so that answers that question.  I honestly never expected the price to remain the same forever and while I didn't like the potential price increase that is when I started to see what else was out there with other providers and what would suit my needs the best.

 

Did PM advertise it as a $3 plan after 5 years or did they use their standard advertising of being able to lower your bill with loyalty?  The cost of your plan is directly related to the features it has, as well as what the competitors are offering for the same or similar features. (we know there is no competition between providers)  Just as we see with gas stations all have the same price when we know they all can't have the same operating costs.  Some will have larger land plots that will cost more and be taxed more, varying staffing level costs depending on hours of operations.  They are pricing their product within the "guidelines the competition" has deemed acceptable.  Putting this on PM "marketing Mavens" for their lack of crystal ball reading of what happens in the future, when they just keep recycling a 2gb promo over and over like it is a new idea is funny.  I considered this plan for my kids but it just didn't meet what  I wanted to provide to them and ended up with the $15 plan for them.

 

Again did they actively promote $3 plans?  It comes down to people having to decide what is best for them and their budget.

 


I am happy to help, but I am not a Customer Support Agent please do not include any personal info in a message to me. Click HERE to create a trouble ticket through SIMon the Chatbot *

darlicious
Mayor / Maire

@paprika 

 

BINGO!!! That would be a full card.

 

 

 

 

To contact customer support click below:

https://productioncommunity.publicmobile.ca/t5/notes/composepage/note-to-user-id/22437

To pre-verify your account include your full name, address, email, phone # and 4 digit acct pin #.

@ShawnC13 

Are you not on the fall 2016 promo? So were you okay with the proposed 25% rate hike from $40/$120 to $50/$150 per 30/90 days back in 2018? Did you defend the company back then for their proposed rate hike? Or were you amidst filling out your CCTS complaint form when it was summarily cancelled due to the outrage and public relations disaster that was created by the 60,000 odd customers with that plan?

 

Rewards should have nothing to do with the rate hike....thats a completely separate issue. Rewards were and still are pm's unique marketing niche and identity that sets them apart from other low cost prepaid providers. The cost of your plan and the features it contains should not dictate a rate hike because the marketing mavens at pm didn't think ahead when offering a low usage, low cost, limited plan that was primarily aimed at seniors, children or those needing an emergency phone for $10/30 days could get it as low as $3/30 days with no other effort than being loyal and having auto pay.

 

Public mobile actively promoted that aspect but are reneging on their own advertising by raising the price before any customer can reach that threshold. So not only can they not reasonably justify a 30% rate hike they promoted the plan with misleading advertising by selling customers a falsehood that by doing nothing but being a loyal customer they could lower their bill to $3. That was patently untrue by virtue that a $3/30 day increase in price makes it impossible for any customer with this plan to reach the $3 plan price.

 

That in itself is worth a complaint to the competition board as well a solid basis for a CCTS complaint. Earning a $20 community reward is misleading too.....but at least 9 customers can earn $20. As it stands no $10 50/50 plan holder can achieve a $3 plan price just by being loyal.

 

 

 

 

 

To contact customer support click below:

https://productioncommunity.publicmobile.ca/t5/notes/composepage/note-to-user-id/22437

To pre-verify your account include your full name, address, email, phone # and 4 digit acct pin #.

@darlicious while the proposed price increase does equal 30% you must also consider that this plan benefits the most from the other rewards.  Autopay is a 20% vs 5% on a $40 and the loyalty is 10% a year up to 50% for 5 years where it is  2.5% a year up to 12.5% on a $40 plan.  So should everyone not on the $10 plan be upset that they haven't been receiving a proportional amount of rewards based on plan value?

 

No one likes a price increase, I see this as a move to get people to move to the $15

 


I am happy to help, but I am not a Customer Support Agent please do not include any personal info in a message to me. Click HERE to create a trouble ticket through SIMon the Chatbot *

BorisDoris
Great Citizen / Super Citoyen

@Meow wrote:

@JL9 wrote:

They won't touch anymore after the 40 plan debacle back in 2018 and that's why I don't they they will phase out the old reward program anytime soon as well 


What was that all about in 2018????


I would like to know too! As I was not a member in 2018.

@Beer 

Telus is testing the waters on rate hikes on grandfathered plans. If this one passes muster then they will target other grandfathered plans until they are left with the fall 2016 promo that caused the uproar 3 years ago if which they learned their lesson on the wording of promotions and they ensure to include "refer to the terms of service" in all of their promotions and plans nowadays so that they can use the "loophole" of 30 days of service of a prepaid plan to arbitrarily raise rates or change the terms of a plan. This does mean its an acceptable practice. Make a formal complaint to public mobile. When they refuse to cancel the rate hike make a formal complaint to the CCTS that public mobile and its parent telus cannot justify the 30% rate hike tariff as reasonable and contravenes the telecommunications act of Canada.

 

Telus is motivated by it's image and it's # 1 customer satisfaction industry rating. Every formal complaint to the CCTS affects their stats and requires a formal investigation. The more complaints the CCTS receives will not only motivate telus to cancel the rate hike but can trigger a review by the CRTC to ask for justification from telus for the tariff which if it goes against the purpose of the act then the CRTC can force telus to cancel the rate hike tariff.

 

 

 

 

To contact customer support click below:

https://productioncommunity.publicmobile.ca/t5/notes/composepage/note-to-user-id/22437

To pre-verify your account include your full name, address, email, phone # and 4 digit acct pin #.

paprika
Good Citizen / Bon Citoyen

‏‏‎ ‎

Meow
Mayor / Maire

@JL9 wrote:

They won't touch anymore after the 40 plan debacle back in 2018 and that's why I don't they they will phase out the old reward program anytime soon as well 


What was that all about in 2018????

JL9
Mayor / Maire

They won't touch anymore after the 40 plan debacle back in 2018 and that's why I don't they they will phase out the old reward program anytime soon as well 

@Beer what do you consider a few people on those plans? 10-20, or 1000-2000?  As consumers, we always hope that a provider or retailer will supply an item that will suit our needs and the price we want to pay when in actuality we need to consider what we are willing to pay for what we need from them.

 


I am happy to help, but I am not a Customer Support Agent please do not include any personal info in a message to me. Click HERE to create a trouble ticket through SIMon the Chatbot *

BorisDoris
Great Citizen / Super Citoyen

Consolidate plans? Avoid to track old and current plan? To much book kepping?

Beer
Town Hero / Héro de la Ville

Since there couldn't possibly be more than a few $10 accounts and decreasing, with no possibility of additional accounts doesn't it seem very petty and not well thought out by whoever thought to do this at PM. 

I think that it would be a good PR move to re-think this and reverse this decision. They should consider that the very limited $10 plan is more for light use by persons that mostly support it for their security just in case.

Perhaps Oracles could point this out to PM.