Auto-pay failure grace period?

[alingus]

Hello, this is perhaps not so much of a question but a suggestion. I had auto-pay set up and for whatever reason, my credit card decided to not be cooperative-- this is not my issue however. My issue is that there was a gap in my access to phone services while I was addressing the payment issue, and as a result I missed an important call from my doctor.

My suggestion is to give a grace period (24-72h?) with continued phone access, in the event of payment failure, so that issues like mine don't come up again. I now have to reschedule my appointment with my doctor, which should not have happened because I should have been able to take his call. I imagine this measure would not be too difficult to add, and it would be a wonderful convenience for longtime loyal customers who have every intention of continued patronage (notwithstanding random credit card failure).

Sorry for the bit of a rant, and I look forward to any feedback.

[BlueB]

@alingus - I like how you described how much of the thought is targeted at the customer to be blamed for payment issues as a prepaid service.  I more or less agree with others about the concept of ensuring that the prepaid service should function only when it's actually pre-paid and that the root cause of the issue should be the thing fixed!

What I see here, is a bridge between everything, for Public Mobile to maintain its service with a real opportunity for improvement, to fix things and offer customers a small grace period and/or triggering Autopay a little earlier.  This would allow customers a chance to correct issues regardless of whose "fault" it is to maintain service.

I don't see anything wrong with their prepaid model, just an opportunity to make things better.  🙂

[popping]

It is how prepaid system work.  Phone stops working without paying on the renewal date. Period, no ifs or buts.  Agree with everyone that the autopay system fails sometime and is not due to the payment info on file.

Agree with @darlicious that everyone on this forum will know about any issue with PM.  Other providers may have similar autopay issue and nobody will know about it because they are not using a community support system.

About the 72 hours grace period, PM sends us a SMS reminder 3 days before our renewal date.  That is the grace period.  Some subscribers use the SMS reminder to add fund to their account using the autopay info manually before their renewal date.  No one has reported that plan does not renewed with enough available fund in the account to pay for plan fee. 

[cellphoneuser1]

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@Jaffar272 wrote:

You address and the address on the credit card should be same . I had a same problem and I tried different credit cards but didn't work so I play a bit with my address and it works.

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Your address can be different than the credit card address but you need to know the credit card address and enter that for payment.  Some people have work addresses or p.o. boxes as credit card billing address or borrow a card from a friend with permission.

[Jaffar272]

You address and the address on the credit card should be same . I had a same problem and I tried different credit cards but didn't work so I play a bit with my address and it works.

[darlicious]

@hTideGnow 

Rogers, Bell and Telus all have autopay failures you just can't find the complaints unless you really dig. Why? Because their community forums are not the basis of their customer support model. What do their customers do when this happens? They pick up their phone and dial 611 so they can complain and the only person to hear about it is the CSA on the other end of the phone.

I do concede that by mere design of the autopay system and the consumer protection we enjoy as a result of pm's limited ability to charge plan amounts to customers cards on file. Anything that can interrupt that one time electronic transmission leads to an autopay failure. And probably more on average than our top tier providers and their more sophisticated payment systems. But you essentially give them the right to charge your pre-authorized card anything they like......and I have always been very wary of giving any company permission to do that......I mean let Robbers have free access to charge my credit card ? PLEASE!!!

Prepaid is prepaid. Much of the world works this way you go camping, see a show, take a holiday flight, fill your tank, order take out, take transit etc....you pay first and then recieve your goods or services. Sure an opt in to pay a day early would be great for all those customers whose lives are too busy to manually pay their accounts and there is no guarantee the payment wouldn't fail on the front end and there would be just as many complaints about opting to pay early and it failing.

[AE_Collector]

Sounds to me like another person who doesn’t understand the difference between Prepay and Postpay service. PM is prepay. For the first several years customers HAD to find a way to get $$ into their account before the 10/30/90 day period expired to avoid no service… Autopay on credit card didn’t exist. 

The BIG difference with Prepay is NO Credit Check is done nor required. You are buying x number of days of cell service and that’s it. The Autopay was put in place because many customers wanted a more convenient way than vouchers to keep service going. They should work on Autopay more to lower the number of failures on PMs side but they really shouldn’t be expected to give free service for other reasons such as new credit card but customer forgot to update their info etc.

JMHO as always, these sort of requests stem from a lack of understanding of what type of service has been subscribed to.

AE_Collector

[Anonymous]

I will vote along softech's post #2. The system knows when a payment fails. Ok. Log that. When done the whole list of payments, then sweep through all those that failed and re-attempt. If that also fails then suspend. Yes there's already kind of a grace period by service continuing until the next morning.

[hTideGnow]

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@ShawnC13 wrote:

wouldn't trust PM to be able to pull this off with their system

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True.  this is exactly the issue here, the system couldn't even process Autopay correctly.

Same for me, I have experience with Rogers, Fido, Bell and other kinds of businesses, their auto debit from CC never failed as long as the card is not expired but why here?

I think the 3 days grace period is too much, 1 day would be great if possible.   Suggestion above for Autopay try again after couple hours might help too.

[ShawnC13]

@alingus, so you are saying like a 3 day grace period and when the person gets things cleared up their next"contact" would be reduced by the number of hours/days that it took to make the payment go through?  PM's system couldn't handle people picking their own plans in the plan builder I can't see it being able to handle a grace period and subtracting however long from the next 30 days.  I understand it is a good idea but I have been around a long time and wouldn't trust PM to be able to pull this off with their system

[softech]

I agree if it is expiry date issue then its not something PM could help. 

 But we also heard so many times Autopay failed for no reason, user could do manually pay after with the same CC on file.. or the CC has no expiry  issue but just PM couldn't get thr money for no reason even with manual pay..

I still think the PM Autopay failed for too many times.  I have autopay on other systems and never have a single issue.

[darlicious]

@alingus 

Midnight for you....11 pm for me....4:30 am for anyone in Newfoundland so their grace period to pay is a more reasonable 8:30 am. The system is designed to best serve the vast majority of customers. If you want to pay early then do so manually.....if you want an alert then figure out how set an alert for when your card doesn''t get charged vs the alerts that tell you when your credit card has been charged.

If you are fast asleep by midnight then you are up early enough to pick up your phone and check if you have service. If not...log in and make a payment it takes a few minutes to do and reactivate.

But really as long as it doesn't fail again next renewal that chances of it failing again after that ?.?are extremely low until the month you get your replacement credit card with a new expiry date.

[hairbag1]

I would take a guesstimate that 50% of the autopay failure are caused by the credit card on file has expired or changed somehow.

I, also, like to manually pay just before next renewal.I still get the Autopay Reward, I've minimized occurrence autopay glitch and I get to visually see what my cell phone plan costs.

I'd be reluctant to pay too far ahead...in case I wanted to flee to a different provider with more attractive plan/costs. Might have a difficult time getting refunded those future payments I made.

[LurganIeUk]

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@alingus wrote:

@BlueB I think auto-pay acting the day before would be a decent compromise, because as it stands, my card gets charged at midnight of the new pay/service period and any issues that arise occur when I'm asleep. I see a lot of replies basically blaming the customer by highlighting the fact that PM is a prepaid service, but it should be in a company's interest to make an opt-in feature like auto-pay as frictionless and seamless as possible, if only to reduce customer churn or increase customer loyalty. I've always been happy with PM, but this incident is making me reconsider. A small grace period is not a huge ask in the large scheme of things.

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So the critical question is "what is the reason for the CC to be uncooperative"?

[alingus]

@BlueB I think auto-pay acting the day before would be a decent compromise, because as it stands, my card gets charged at midnight of the new pay/service period and any issues that arise occur when I'm asleep. I see a lot of replies basically blaming the customer by highlighting the fact that PM is a prepaid service, but it should be in a company's interest to make an opt-in feature like auto-pay as frictionless and seamless as possible, if only to reduce customer churn or increase customer loyalty. I've always been happy with PM, but this incident is making me reconsider. A small grace period is not a huge ask in the large scheme of things.

[softech]

yes, autopay the night before could be a solution..

but of course, there would be others complaining they want to opt out midnight and why got charged early.. lol

[darlicious]

@alingus 

You do get about a 4 hour grace period between 2am and 6 am eastern on the day of your renewal from the approximate time autopay attempts to charge your card (2 am) and the time (6 am) pm will suspend your services for non payment (or deactivate the account if its been suspended for 90 days.) If you have something that is important enough requiring your mobile services that coincides with your renewal setting your alarm to check your account and make a manual payment if you are unlucky enough to suffer an autopay failure is an option.

When I had to worry about paying for my services I made a manual payment every month usually the day before renewal. I would also review the account to make sure everything was in order and take screenshots of my overview and transaction pages. I do the same after renewal. I look at autopay as a back up safety net in case I forget to pay the bill rather than rely on it to pay for my services.

In the whole scheme of things....autopay failures represent a miniscule percentage of customers that experience this issue. No automatic payment system is perfect and no provider has a fool proof system. However pm's autopay unlike other provider's will only attempt to charge your card on file once. You do not give pm carte blanche to bill your credit/debit card as you do with other services that you have set up pre-authorized payments.

I pay all of my bills manually either online or at a bank machine after I have fully reviewed the paper bill ( when possible) to make sure there are no errors or teeny tiny typeface telling me my services are going up in price. I have always done this but bf's contract with fido taught me to never trust a service provider is putting your best interests first. 18 months of monthly billing errors, overages and frankly fraudulent charges upwards of $100 each and every month keeps me vigilant.

I catch "honest" billing errors all the time....1/3 reciepts and/or billing statements I review have a mistake and it is rarely in my favour. I am astonished at how many people are willing to be ripped off by a service provider or put complete trust in their credit card issuer just for the convenience of an automatic payment.

[LurganIeUk]

I would have to disagree with asking PM to have this option. Prepaid every where is hard and fast...pay on time or lose service. If an error on the side of the vendor then it should be graciously fixed for you, no hassle. 

So the critical question is "what is the reason for the CC to be uncooperative"?

Today we seem to use auto pays and online payment options. No more visits to the local Cable Provider or Bank to pay a bill or to mail a cheque......and some may ask...what is a cheque??

It is the responsibility of a customer to have some method of knowing what they have set up for bill payments and what a new credit card in the mail means to your payment methods. ie. a new credit cards means you have renew that card information on all of your auto pay set ups. 

[BlueB]

You're onto something here, @alingus about giving users some opportunity to correct the payment issue before suspending service.  I also like @softech's idea about retrying after 2 hours.

Come to think of it - I'm with another service provider (not phone service) that provides me coverage monthly on the 1st of every month.  However, automatic payment for the next month occurs the night before at 7pm.  If that fails, you get a notification which allows you to jump in and correct the problem so that payment can be retried.  This worked well once when a card needed to be replaced but wasn't updated in their system.  🙂

[alingus]

@ShawnC13 

A grace period doesn't mean an extension to the service period, it's just additional time to finalize payment. I honestly don't see a way for there to be an epidemic of scammers, especially if it's limited to those who have set up auto-pay. Moreover, PM gives data freebies periodically anyway, so it's not like there's a scarcity of product on their end that necessitates cracking down on their customers.

[LurganIeUk]

@softech 

lol....me = senior!!!

PM is unlikely to ever fix it. The PM system is easy to see as an extract from the Telus Prepaid system. I was hit only a couple of times with the miss of auto-pay and was on Telus for about 15 years...so not bad. And if I recall..I had no idea that it failed and had no service. Once discovered Telus fixed it quick and they were quite aware of the problem and how to handle it. Then  I was in contact with Telus Loyalty over an issue with both of your accounts having too large of a balance and rather than having them assign an unwanted plan add-on they put them on a plan for $100 a year and it would be paid from my balance (and was promised that my balance would not expire) so no more auto pay failure. So paying in advance became more of an reassurance of the plan always working. And actually paying a year in advance is less hassle for sure. I would like to see PM come back with the 90 day payment. 

If you do pay in advance the only caution I have is.....don't let it build up too high as you never know when or why you might need to change your service provider, and is not advantageous to lose those funds in your balance. And more so if you are heavily on the PM rewards system. 

Now your point about critical......with numbers of folks that no longer have a land line....with the loss of phone booths in general and loss of ashtrays in vehicles (full of quarters)......I would say that ANY PM customer would need to have the option  to make critical calls. 

And say for my wife and I for $13 a month or less.....using the hybrid system is a cost of $26 x 2 and $13 a month x 2 there after. It is not a bad alternative is it? But is a loss of "auto", but I don't mind doing the manual process as I have a bill paying regimen one day every week. But some one on a $70 plan may not want to do it.  I understand it. But then "critical" will always have to be considered. 

[ShawnC13]

@alingus, while that would be nice to have I can see people taking advantage of it and now getting 33 days of service for the cost of 30 and continue doing this.  As a prepaid service, this is how it should work, if there hasn't been a payment to continue service it will be suspended.  Postpaid can add late payment fees and such but that isn't possible here.  It is unfortunate you missed the call but the suggestion made by @will13am  is the best solution.  Find the problem and eliminate it.

[softech]

the hybrid model.. i still not comfortable with the idea.. why we need to do extra to cover up PM's error?  PM should look into the Autopay and fix it.. we should keep pressing PM to get a solution.  

of course, I agree if it is emergency phones for kids.. for seniors, you really should like into this hybrid model and manually pay monthly to avoid surprises

and for those who says they use the phone for business calls and not afford to miss.. i always think PM is not a place for critical business phones. Prepaid is just not the right model for business phones

[esjliv]

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@alingus wrote:

Hello, this is perhaps not so much of a question but a suggestion. I had auto-pay set up and for whatever reason, my credit card decided to not be cooperative-- this is not my issue however. My issue is that there was a gap in my access to phone services while I was addressing the payment issue, and as a result I missed an important call from my doctor.

My suggestion is to give a grace period (24-72h?) with continued phone access, in the event of payment failure, so that issues like mine don't come up again. I now have to reschedule my appointment with my doctor, which should not have happened because I should have been able to take his call. I imagine this measure would not be too difficult to add, and it would be a wonderful convenience for longtime loyal customers who have every intention of continued patronage (notwithstanding random credit card failure).

Sorry for the bit of a rant, and I look forward to any feedback.

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@alingus  Yes, it is really too bad that Autopay Failures happen. But this IS a prepaid service, so you must pay before you get the services, like any other prepay service.

I know some people pay ahead of renewal dates, in the event, of a failure. I think this is silly too, since...It. Should. Not. Fail.

Perhaps, that is why some people prefer Postpaid services.

Go ahead and rant, all you want, we all do sometimes. 🙂

[LurganIeUk]

@alingus 

If you can afford to do...try the hybrid auto pay. 

Set up your account with auto pay. That alone gives you $2 a month off. 

Pay 2 months in advance. 

Each time PM texts you of your payment is "taken", then pay again using the online top up process. 

Then any errors from PM for auto pay won't  happen and a CC issue can be discovered in advance and fixed with out any disruption of phone service.  

[softech]

good idea.. but not sure PM willing to do it.

and if the Autopay is failed , maybe PM should automatic re-try after 2 hours.  Many time we see, it's an Autopay issue rather than credit card.  We see that many times, customers went back and pay manually  with the existing credit card on the system, the payment went through, so, the initial failure was likely on the PM side.  If PM could re-attempt in 2 hours.. probably it will save a lot of the hassle.

[will13am]

This sounds like a reasonable approach but I sense it won't work.  Until the service actually gets interrupted, customer will tend not to do anything or may not have full awareness of the autopay failure.  The real solution is to find the cause and eliminate it.