Effective February 15th, changes are happening to Legacy/ Pioneer rate plans

[Brooke_C]

Hey Community,

We have some important information to share with our Legacy/Pioneer customers. As a reminder, Legacy/Pioneer customers are those who continue to have access to the call centre and are on one of the five plans listed below.

• $22 Province-Wide Talk
• $28 Canada-Wide Talk + Text
• $43 Canada-Wide Talk + Text + 1GB Data
• $48 Canadian & U.S. Talk + Text + 1GB Data
• $63 Canadian & U.S. Talk + Text + 2GB Data

As you know, Public Mobile has been on a journey to become an online-only brand and give Canadians control of their wireless spend. Along this journey, we will need to make some changes to adapt. To that end, effective February 15^th, 2018, all Legacy/Pioneer rate plans will increase in price. The reason for the price increase is simple: operating a call centre is expensive and, as the number of Legacy/Pioneer customers decreases, we lose the scale that has allowed us to operate it to date.

With that said, what we care about most is our customers and we want you to continue feeling good about your wireless choice, so we’ve worked with our sister brand, Koodo, to offer all Legacy/Pioneer customers a way to keep the same price. For a limited time, from January 10^th to February 9^th, 2018, Legacy/Pioneer customers can join Koodo with a similar rate plan that they have now with Public Mobile, at the same price they pay today. If you are a Legacy/Pioneer customer, you are eligible for this offer and you will be hearing from us over the next few days with details on how to take advantage of this deal.

If you are not a Legacy/Pioneer customer, this price increase and the above offer do not apply to you and you can continue enjoying your current plan.

To learn more, visit publicmobile.ca/serviceupdate.   

Thank you for your continued support as we evolve and change 

The Public Mobile Team

[ottawa]

We went through the same thing last time when the plans went up $3 (to $28 and $43, in our cases). The Koodo offer is not the same as the current PM plans, for one thing it's postpaid not prepaid though the no-shock data is a nice feature that avoids the biggest worry with postpaid (running up a $50 data overage without knowing it). But not everyone wants postpaid in any case.

PM makes a big deal about the call centre being the feature driving this (though somehow a no-data $28/mo user is cost 2.5x as much as a 1GB $43/mo user, based on increases of $5 and $2 respectively). It would be better (for us) to remove call centre support from the plan and (maybe) then offer it as a $2 or $5 add-on. Is there actually a PM call centre at this point, or is it just some of the Koodo agents trained to take PM calls as well?

Moving to postpaid Koodo costs us our add-ons, loses the ability to leave the account unpaid when on vacation. I might be able to match my $43/mo on a new plan, but current PM plans less flexible (90-day cycles instead of 30-day) to do that ($45/mo for 1GB & Canada-wide, less a loyalty discount I guess).

The last time round, I advised my other friends on PM to stick with PM. This time around, my advice will be different. It's too bad, some of our group have been with PM since it was $15/mo. 😞

=aw

[srlawren]

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@kav2001c wrote:

That actually is one of the advantages of going postpaid on Koodo

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@kav2001c my understanding was that your plan is only price protected on post-paid when you are in a contract.  I can't say for sure but assumed these Koodo deals would be month-to-month?

[alanbrenan]

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@kav2001c wrote:

@srlawren & @alanbrenan you guys are both barking up the wrong tree

http://crtc.gc.ca/eng/phone/mobile/codesimpl.htm

This is simplified version of Wireless Code but issue is the same

Note the (very important) line about WHICH terms apply to Prepay contracts

The following sections of the Code also apply to prepaid services: A.1-3; B.2; E.1, E.4, and E.5; F.1-4; G.1-4; and J.1.

Notice anything missing?

Say like Section D?

(Technically they do not even require to give 30 days notice of changes to a prepay contract, they can notify you the day of your renewal and nothing in writing is required UNLESS you request the Critical Info Summary which I assume a Mod would gladly mail you)

Prepay has no price protection whatsoever (prove me wrong with a section if you like but I doubt you find anything)

Public could double prices tomorrow

That actually is one of the advantages of going postpaid on Koodo

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This was the point @srlawren and I were making in regards to Claude's comment about written notice. Unless the Quebec Consumer's Act to which Claude is under the purview of (PM could potentially be as well.) takes precedence over the Wireless Code, there's no legal ramifications to things being changed around and no legal shield a customer can use to stop changes from happening or to seek restitution.

My quoting of the Wireless Act was more-or-less to add to the discussion started by @claude1960 on whether or not the actions the PM team has taken are legal. My references were in defense of it being legal.

[kav2001c]

@srlawren & @alanbrenan you guys are both barking up the wrong tree

http://crtc.gc.ca/eng/phone/mobile/codesimpl.htm

This is simplified version of Wireless Code but issue is the same

Note the (very important) line about WHICH terms apply to Prepay contracts

The following sections of the Code also apply to prepaid services: A.1-3; B.2; E.1, E.4, and E.5; F.1-4; G.1-4; and J.1.

Notice anything missing?

Say like Section D?

(Technically they do not even require to give 30 days notice of changes to a prepay contract, they can notify you the day of your renewal and nothing in writing is required UNLESS you request the Critical Info Summary which I assume a Mod would gladly mail you)

Prepay has no price protection whatsoever (prove me wrong with a section if you like but I doubt you find anything)

Public could double prices tomorrow

That actually is one of the advantages of going postpaid on Koodo

[kav2001c]

@claude1960 well last year the Koodo plans were *identical* to the Public plans

But this year Public has been very tight lipped

Out of curiosity what is the new plan offer?

As to keeping same plan, esp if you indicate you never use call centre, why not simply chnage plans then?

You currently pay $28 for Canada wide talk & text

Public current new plan is cheaper PLUS you get DATA

90 Day plan + Canada Wide calling + Global TXT + 1.5GB (3G) Data = $105

You would get (at least) $6 off for Loyalty reward

And $6 off for prepayment

So $105 - $12 = $93 per 90 Days ($31 per 30 days) + possibility to earn refer or community rewards as well

Is there any reason you wish to hold on to the older Legacy plan other than call centre?

[alanbrenan]

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@srlawren wrote:

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alanbrenan wrote: 

EDIT: I have researched this a bit further and have found Quebec's Consumer Act (which @claude1960 references earlier in this thread as he is likely Québécois) does state notice needs to be written. 

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@alanbrenan interesting development.  I wonder if texting does satisfy that or not?  It's certainly not verbal.  And there is a "paper" trail (PM would have a record of having sent the text(s) communicating the change).  I'm definitely not a legal expert in any way, particular when it comes to the province of Quebec, but I'm guessing it *might* just qualify.

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I figured it would be worth mentioning! In the 2013 review of the old Wireless Code states that Quebec wished to remain independent from its' rulings. I couldn't find clarification on whether or not this was approved on the federal level.

I'm also no legal expert, and have taken no post-secondary courses in law. (although interested in doing so later in life!) However, I personally believe the text message, forum post and notice on Self Serve account (which could double as a bill) would qualify as written notice.

[srlawren]

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alanbrenan wrote: 

EDIT: I have researched this a bit further and have found Quebec's Consumer Act (which @claude1960 references earlier in this thread as he is likely Québécois) does state notice needs to be written. 

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@alanbrenan interesting development.  I wonder if texting does satisfy that or not?  It's certainly not verbal.  And there is a "paper" trail (PM would have a record of having sent the text(s) communicating the change).  I'm definitely not a legal expert in any way, particular when it comes to the province of Quebec, but I'm guessing it *might* just qualify.

[alanbrenan]

@claude1960 wrote:

@srlawren

I'll inquire about that but I don't think a text is a writen notice according to the law. I'm still looking for the increase over the cost of living. I've read it before and can't find it at the moment.

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Adherent to the CRTC's Wireless Code (français) term "written" is never specified with notice in regards to a change in services. If you cannot resolve this issue with Public Mobile and still feel unhappy with the service, the CRTC does offer a complaint service (français) that may help you to understand whether or not PM's actions are considered "misconduct" by their standards.

I do sincerely hope it doesn't need to come to that, however. I don't believe PM would ever try to do away with their veteran members maliciously. Their offer in this thread shows that they are loyal to their members and it was extra legwork I am doubtful they needed to do!

EDIT: I have researched this a bit further and have found Quebec's Consumer Act (which @claude1960 references earlier in this thread as he is likely Québécois) does state notice needs to be written. Due to being anglophone, my research into Quebec's Acts and whether or not CRTC or Quebec's act takes precedence is limited.

EDIT (dejavu!): Included in Public Mobile's ToS is pretty well my first paragraph.

[claude1960]

@srlawren

I'll inquire about that but I don't think a text is a writen notice according to the law. I'm still looking for the increase over the cost of living. I've read it before and can't find it at the moment.

[srlawren]

@claude1960 thank you.  Yes that 30 days is what I was lead to believe as well.  I beleive they have provided that now, have they not?  I think that's why the price change goes into effect Feb 15th, to provide that sufficient notice period.

The Service Terms are linked at the bottom of every page on publicmobile.ca, including the main website, the community (here), and the self-serve system.  Here's the link:

https://publicmobile.ca/en/on/privacy-legal?section=serviceTerms

EDIT: and that page links you to this PDF:

https://www.publicmobile.ca/pdfs/Public_Mobile_Terms_of_Service.pdf

EDIT again:  this appears to be the relevant section:

"

Can the terms of service change?

Yes, Public Mobile has the right to change any of the terms of service, including rates, without notice. Changes become effective thirty days after being posted at publicmobile.ca/ plans. By purchasing service after a change is posted, including by continuing to top up your account, you accept the current terms of service. You can cancel service at any time, without penalty or cancellation fees.

" 

[claude1960]

@srlawren

Here's the link:
https://www.opc.gouv.qc.ca/consommateur/bien-service/cellulaire/modification/contrat-modification/

It's in short surely after you read it you'll see that they have to write to us at least 30 days before the change happen. I'm looking to find the contract made between me and PM.
Would you know where to findit?

[srlawren]

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@claude1960 wrote:

@srlawren

You're welcome to get involve.
The thing that you say "They are quite able to just raise the price on you as long as they give you sufficient notice, this is within their rights" show how little you know about the law. What bugs me is all the answers of people without knowing what they're talking about. I mention in another reply that PM has raised 11% last year and now it's gonna be 17%, nothing is legal about this. Let it be writen that: If anybody would start a class action PM would have to give a lot of money back. The downside is it would take about 10 years.

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@claude1960 Please go there, I'd love to be educated about this.  We are not under contract, we are month-to-month and to the best of my--admittedly limited--knowledge is that we are not affordeed any price protection for our rate plans.  This may be my ignorance, so I do invite you to please point me in the direction of the laws that say otherwise.  I'm not trying to be a jerk here, I'm trying to learn what I may not be aware of.

[claude1960]

@srlawren

You're welcome to get involve.
The thing that you say "They are quite able to just raise the price on you as long as they give you sufficient notice, this is within their rights" show how little you know about the law. What bugs me is all the answers of people without knowing what they're talking about. I mention in another reply that PM has raised 11% last year and now it's gonna be 17%, nothing is legal about this. Let it be writen that: If anybody would start a class action PM would have to give a lot of money back. The downside is it would take about 10 years.
I'm not going there, just to show you that you're missing some facts too about their rights.

Finaly I'm  looking around at other options including PM.

[claude1960]

@wetcoaster

I got that before you wrote it, thank you sir.
Oups I hope it's "sir".

[srlawren]

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@claude1960 wrote:

You write "all my comments don't make sense" because you don't know who I reply to.
Well I hit reply and the repliy should be under the post I replied to.
And I didn't go to school to know that. Unless I'm out of line and this site puts my replies anywhere.

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@claude1960 No school is required.  If you're responding to an older reply in the thread, try using the Quote button (as I have here).  This gives people the context to your replies.  If you scroll back up this page and look at your series of replies, there is no context to them which makes it really hard to understand what you were trying to communicate, and to whom.  This is my two cents on the matter, take it for what it's worth.

[srlawren]

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@claude1960 wrote:

Who are you to assume that I don't know about that?  You know what it means to /u/me?

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@claude1960 I wasn't going to get involved here but please note that @wetcoaster was just trying to be helpful and outine some suggestions.  If you are here to vent only, then so be it I suppose.  You're entitled to be ticked off, I would be too.  On the other hand, PM is a business and they have to set the direction and pricing they think they need in order to stay healthy and competitive.  They are quite able to just raise the price on you as long as they give you sufficient notice, this is within their rights to do.  It's within your rights to look around at other options if you are not happy about it.  You may want to look at some of the talk+text options available at competitors to see if something will meet your needs and budget better.  Vote with your wallet, if you are truly unhappy about the change.

[claude1960]

Oh! It just occured to me....

You need a name (like you did) to know who I answer too.

@wetcoaster

[claude1960]

You write "all my comments don't make sense" because you don't know who I reply to.
Well I hit reply and the repliy should be under the post I replied to.
And I didn't go to school to know that. Unless I'm out of line and this site puts my replies anywhere.

[claude1960]

Who are you to assume that I don't know about that?  You know what it means to /u/me?
My point is that they send a message to switch to Koodo saying similar plans which isn't true at all. They already raised the prices last year by 11% and now the raise is 17% only for the  Legacy/Pioneer  customers. Claiming the cost of the call center. 
Is it only me that sees the gross misconduct from Public Mobile?

[wetcoaster]

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@claude1960 wrote:

The fact is that you just raise the prices to get rid of us....
I'm one of the Legacy/ Pioneer customer, with the basic plan of $28, and I don't use the call center.
Instead of use false pretenses just close the call center.
Again the facts aren't true otherwise they would closed it long time ago to save money.

And all of you who say "bravo" get your facts straight...Koodo doesn't offer the similar rate plan.
I have canada wide plan illimited (WICH KOODO DOESN'T OFFER) as of now, january 15th, they haven't been able to offer me a plan  something remotly close to what I have for $28.
Talk about customer service, PUBLIC MOBILE WANTS TO GET RID OF (OLD PLAN)  Legacy/Pioneer CUSTOMERS.

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@claude1960

As mentioned by others in this thread Public Mobile could use a more heavy handed approach on their way to become an online only provider, but they have chosen to give you another chance to pick one of three options.

- Pay more for call centre support.

- Switch to Koodo special (post paid, but you'll keep phone support)

- Switch to an in-market plan with Public Mobile

I have done the math for switching to an in-market plan before but here it is again, based on the $28 Legacy Plan, which will be $33 after February 15.

If you switch to an in-market plan you'll be eligible for rewards. If you sign up for auto pay that's $2/30days off, your loyalty rewards at this point would be $3/30days.

This is the equivalent in-market plan at Public Mobile.

With your loyalty ($3) and autopay ($2) rewards it comes to $30/30days.

As @mimmo has pointed out you could add 500MB of data (per 30days) for the exactly same total:

If you rarely call to destinations outside your province you could go with unlimited province wide talk and global text for $75/90days before rewards (comes to $20/30days with rewards) and combine it with a long distance add-on ($8 for 200min, $15 for 400min, the minutes don't expire).

If you choose to change to an in-market plan you need to call *611. They want to make sure that you understand that you'll loose the phone support.

Edited: All your other comments don't make sense since it's not clear who you are replying to.

[claude1960]

For who?

It's not a catch it's a aspic. Which is a snake venom.

[claude1960]

I agree with your comment.
I check and nothing comes close to my basic plan.

[claude1960]

Why do you comment without inquiring?
Would you go to work without your tools?

[claude1960]

Sure as long as they move you too.

[claude1960]

Just sound like it.

Not fair at all, I'm sure you're not a  Legacy/Pioneer  customer

[claude1960]

What is not bad...your thoughts.
It's like someone laughing at his own joke.
Let the other say what they think about it, I say worst offer ever,

Because they want to get rid of  Legacy/Pioneer  customers.

[claude1960]

Thumbs down

Why do you thing it's not offer in the emoticon 

[claude1960]

NOT THE SAME AT ALL GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT

[claude1960]

The fact is that you just raise the prices to get rid of us....
I'm one of the Legacy/ Pioneer customer, with the basic plan of $28, and I don't use the call center.
Instead of use false pretenses just close the call center.
Again the facts aren't true otherwise they would closed it long time ago to save money.

And all of you who say "bravo" get your facts straight...Koodo doesn't offer the similar rate plan.
I have canada wide plan illimited (WICH KOODO DOESN'T OFFER) as of now, january 15th, they haven't been able to offer me a plan  something remotly close to what I have for $28.
Talk about customer service, PUBLIC MOBILE WANTS TO GET RID OF (OLD PLAN)  Legacy/Pioneer CUSTOMERS.

[kav2001c]

@ShawnC13 I think removing call centre access would be breaching wireless code (fundamental change in services) 

Having said that, it seems obvious they will just keep doing incremental increases in price until all Legacy plans are gone

I am surprised people have not changed to current in market plans at this point (as going postpaid with Koodo I suspect is an issue for many)