Accuracy of information?

[Korth]

I'm apprehensive about fanning the flames on what is still a vehemently controversial topic, but I am seeking information.  I understand this is still a sensitive issue, and I understand how angry I'd be if I felt betrayed or deceived.

Many people have been dropping links, citing sources, and quoting numbers which don't seem to really point at or be backed up by relevant information.

For instance, many people say the CCTS now has thousands of complaints filed over PM's recently misleading/deceptive marketing promotions.  It's pretty evident that most of the recent discussions are indeed condemning PM for this, many PM customers are now suspicious, many others have left (or will be leaving) and won't be coming back.  I'm not disputing any of this stuff.

What I am asking for is direct links to this information.  Where is the number of complaints vs PM (or even summarized numbers of total complaints) actually reported anywhere on the CCTS sites?  Where are the official statements from Public Mobile or from Telus about this scandal?  Where are the regulatory decrees or rulings which officially describe the problem and prescribe the solution?  Where are any "facts" about this to be found anywhere online?  I don't consider quoting each other "factual", somebody always has to say things first and that person has to obtain "facts" from somewhere ... so where is that exactly?

I could find no such information anywhere on the internet beyond these Public Mobile forums.  But perhaps I'm just not looking in the right places?  If so, please provide me with working links to all this information anywhere in this thread.  Direct and specific links to active public domain internet content, I assure you that I have already used all the search functions at places like the CCTS sites and I've not yet found anything recent or relevant.

I've recently taken the liberty of un-vandalizing the Wikipedia article about PM.  This scandal, fiasco, controversy, betrayal - whatever it's called - should be noted at Wikipedia, I don't believe in promoting misinformation.  But it should also be accurate and unbiased, or at the very least it should point to authority sources so that visitors can judge for themselves, I don't believe in promoting disinformation either.

[computergeek541]

We don't really know for sure about any of this stuff.  The number of CCTS complaints is speculation. There is no way for us to confirm exactly how many complaints were submitted by Public Mobile customers during that period of time, or to even know if every single one of those complaints were about the same thing (although most, if not all, probably were).  Although unlilkely, it's also possible that one person could have have sumitted multiple complaints, or that there could have also been a large number of complaints against another carrier duing the same time period.

The only thing official that we're ever likely to see with be a year-end CCTS report, but even that will probably not state the exact number of complaints for this one issue, but would probably just give a total number of complaints into general categories against Telus as a whole.  While there likley was a large influx of complaints from Public Mobile customers, any number given right now could not be considered a concrete fact.

As for the talk about possibly thousands of complaint -.  heck, we don't even know exactly how many Public Mobile customers are even on this price plan.

[slavitch]

No, I made four complaints for four accounts. It's a sequentially increasing number. 

[Korth]

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@slavitchwrote:

The complaint number you get at the end of the process is a monotonically increasing sequential number.

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That's probably correct.  But it's also an assumption.  Many businesses randomize or semi-randomize numbers on their queues, files, orders, etc - deliberately and specifically to impede customer-side analysis of their work output.  For all we know, each CCTS complaint is incremented by a random count or is assigned some random (or only internally meaningful) digits.

We also don't know that every complaint submitted to the CCTS is about Public Mobile.  Public Mobile is only one among over two dozen Canadian mobile phone companies.  And only a small part of the Telus (which is incidentally the smallest of the Big Three).  It seems reasonable to assume that the CCTS gets a constant trickle of complaints and that in the normal course of things ~72% of them have nothing to do with anything Telus, and that only a small fraction of the remaining ~28% have anything to do with PM.

I realize that PM's unpopular stunt probably represents a big influx of CCTS complaints in recent days.  But that doesn't mean the >99% of Canadian cellphone users who aren't on PM have nothing to complain about.

[slavitch]

The complaint number you get at the end of the process is a monotonically increasing sequential number.  The returned complaint number returned to me on Friday is several thousand digits higher than the one returned on Thursday. If you average out the number of complaints they've received it averages in the low  hundreds (200-300) per day. Something spiked.  

[Korth]

I can't confirm these results anywhere at RFD or reddit.  Though it's possible any relevant threads/posts have been removed.  But even so, these numbers still seem like speculation and hearsay.

The number of users commenting about this scandal at PM, RFD, and reddit seem more like many dozens or perhaps a few hundreds - and, of course, countless others likely haven't posted any online comments at all - but it seems unlikely to me that they've collectively filed several thousand CCTS complaints.

[MVP]

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@Korthwrote:

I'm apprehensive about fanning the flames on what is still a vehemently controversial topic, but I am seeking information.  I understand this is still a sensitive issue, and I understand how angry I'd be if I felt betrayed or deceived.

Many people have been dropping links, citing sources, and quoting numbers which don't seem to really point at or be backed up by relevant information.

For instance, many people say the CCTS now has thousands of complaints filed over PM's recently misleading/deceptive marketing promotions.  It's pretty evident that most of the recent discussions are indeed condemning PM for this, many PM customers are now suspicious, many others have left (or will be leaving) and won't be coming back.  I'm not disputing any of this stuff.

What I am asking for is direct links to this information.  Where is the number of complaints vs PM (or even summarized numbers of total complaints) actually reported anywhere on the CCTS sites?  Where are the official statements from Public Mobile or from Telus about this scandal?  Where are the regulatory decrees or rulings which officially describe the problem and prescribe the solution?  Where are any "facts" about this to be found anywhere online?  I don't consider quoting each other "factual", somebody always has to say things first and that person has to obtain "facts" from somewhere ... so where is that exactly?

I could find no such information anywhere on the internet beyond these Public Mobile forums.  But perhaps I'm just not looking in the right places?  If so, please provide me with working links to all this information anywhere in this thread.  Direct and specific links to active public domain internet content, I assure you that I have already used all the search functions at places like the CCTS sites and I've not yet found anything recent or relevant.

I've recently taken the liberty of un-vandalizing the Wikipedia article about PM.  This scandal, fiasco, controversy, betrayal - whatever it's called - should be noted at Wikipedia, I don't believe in promoting misinformation.  But it should also be accurate and unbiased, or at the very least it should point to authority sources so that visitors can judge for themselves, I don't believe in promoting disinformation either.

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I've learned about ~2500 CCTS complaints from RFD, where someone estimated it from the assigned case numbers, fhat seems consecutive (last  minus first). I do not have a direct link, but those curious might search fhe corresponding thread (over 100 pages).

[will13am]

As far as I can tell, it will be some time before we will know officially the number of complaints this fiasco generated.  The CCTS do publish stats annually and mid term.  I suspect those who are reporting numbers may be guessing through comparing complaint confirmation numbers with friends.  It could easily be in the thousands.  I wonder if there's a simplified process that Telus will use to clear them.  Although they backtracked on the price increase, the complainant may have further issues or requested resolution different than removing the price increase that need to be officially dealt with and recorded.  There is a lot of spilt milk that needs to be cleaned up.  I would hate to be a member of the janitor crew.