Threads going off topic

[darlicious]

 Oracles please feel free to move this thread to the lounge as you feel fit. It seems as though a new category needs to be created to deal with community topic issues that are related to public mobile (as this is pm's community forum) that are phone related but not necessarily related to an issue caused by or offered by or not offered by pm. But are not lounge related topics like how great is it that the Winnipeg Blue Bombers won the Grey Cup?  This might satisfy users who have questions about phones, community etiquette, technology etc that are related to and can effect how users use the forum, their phone, data plans etc...with public mobile but is not directly related to solving an immeadiate issue. I.E. my data is not working! Nor will need a moderator to intervene to solve. Discussions in this new category could be given a lesser amount consideration towards community rewards but more than none that is given to posts in the lounge.

 Lately it seems but inevitably some threads have wandered off topic by no fault of any particular poster but continue off topic by way of users wanting to and interested in the new discussion. Coming from the top we have been told to avoid this but as a common user there is no way/power for us to change that other than to stop the discussion. It does not help users to be admonished by the powers that be for a thread that goes it's own way. If oracles have the power to move and merge threads...can a user make a new post/thread in the category that seems appropriate or in the future the "community" category and request that the oracles split the now off topic thread in the most reasonable place it has gone off topic and move it to the new thread and make a note to those who want to contribute to the original or the newly created thread where it is and what has changed?

[computergeek541]

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@will13am wrote:

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I recall there was a time where there was guilt felt when repeating a post.  Some people would go and edit out their suggestion because it was repetitive.  When I refer to people spending countless hours here, it is obviously not referring to those who just read forum posts but to those who are actively trying to "add value".  

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The way that you can start typing a reply and then post it, only to see that 5 other people have already said the same thing is one thing. I'm not too worried about that.  But, if I realize that I've repeated someone 2 hours later by mistake because I skimmed through the thread but later realized that I missed something, I'll sometimes go back and just blank out my message. That's not because I need to add a message to my post count, but because I feel guilty I would be wasting peoples' time by having them read it (again).

[will13am]

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@computergeek541 wrote:

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@will13am wrote:

They are willing to camp here 18 hours a day and take short cuts like make multiple accounts and do self promotion to get there.  When there is nothing to respond to, people will continue to discuss existing and old threads to page 5 just to keep the post count up! 

How do you police this kind of nonsense?  No amount of post movements and categorization will fix it.  What people need to do is take stock of the effort they put in against the potential rewards they get out of it and recalibrate their time here.  Get a life so to speak.

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If someone wants to spend 10 hours or more a day on the Community, that's fine by me if the person can find the time to do that. But the nonsense posts are a serious problem.  I'm not talking about a thread where there's some socializing going on in a few messages. That's going to happen. 

I'm speaking of the deliberate nonsense that has clearly been going on with some members going in and either giving silly answers that have nothing to do with the topic of a thread, or repeating an answer from 12 hours, 3 days, or 6 months ago just to get to some arbritary 50 or 100 message per day or week post count quota.  I fully realize that some repitition happens by accident (a member might not have seen a previous message, or a message is posted a few minutes after the previous person says the same thing), but there are some who are clearly doing it on purpose based the rate at which this occurs with some.

I believe that the post count aspect of the Community reward secret forumula needs to be tweaked/de-emphasized. The quality of message posts in the Community needs to increase, not the amount of messages posted.

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I recall there was a time where there was guilt felt when repeating a post.  Some people would go and edit out their suggestion because it was repetitive.  When I refer to people spending countless hours here, it is obviously not referring to those who just read forum posts but to those who are actively trying to "add value".  

[sheytoon]

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@will13am wrote:

It has become a competition for the tiny amount of community rewards to the point that the waste of human capital is just astonishing. 

That's one of the reasons I've dialed back my time here. When someone responds to a question thoughtfully, it gets drowned out by 10 useless responses within a minute.

I can't imagine how frustrating it must be to the people asking for help. They're bombarded with irrelevant and contradictory information.

[will13am]

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@darlicious wrote:

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@will13am wrote:

@darlicious , TL;DR.  I am going to say the community at large is at fault, no specific finger pointing but guilt is not evenly spread of course.  When I joined the community forum 3 years ago, it was not nearly as active as today.  It has become a competition for the tiny amount of community rewards to the point that the waste of human capital is just astonishing.  Yet, people want that glory to be on the top of the leaderboard.  They are willing to camp here 18 hours a day and take short cuts like make multiple accounts and do self promotion to get there.  When there is nothing to respond to, people will continue to discuss existing and old threads to page 5 just to keep the post count up! 

How do you police this kind of nonsense?  No amount of post movements and categorization will fix it.  What people need to do is take stock of the effort they put in against the potential rewards they get out of it and recalibrate their time here.  Get a life so to speak.

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@will13am  Yes I certainly see your point. I may spend more time here than I should but it often comprises more reading than anything else. I don't feel the need to comment or post when the solution has been made or it offers no value to the OP. Unfortunately some members do try to game the system or just post for post count. But i have noticed the direct correlation that the quality of post far outweighs the value of post and bravo count so that those who make the community reward decisions have that issue fully under control. Time wasted skimming thru posts  of poor value is irritating but are rewarded by the informative or more thought provoking ones. Given that many times I'm online at off peak times it can be disappointing to not have any one to help when that is my intention...maybe just for the good  Samaritan endorphins    

my brain is seeking is far more of the addiction than the rewards others may want.

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Back in the day, getting a bravo for making a post was not a given.  In fact, I recall bravos were very hard to get sometimes, nearly as difficult as a solution.  These days bravos are given for wrong answers as if it is obligatory to bravo like giving a tip for bad service.  One way to modify bad behavior is not to reward it.  

[computergeek541]

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@will13am wrote:

They are willing to camp here 18 hours a day and take short cuts like make multiple accounts and do self promotion to get there.  When there is nothing to respond to, people will continue to discuss existing and old threads to page 5 just to keep the post count up! 

How do you police this kind of nonsense?  No amount of post movements and categorization will fix it.  What people need to do is take stock of the effort they put in against the potential rewards they get out of it and recalibrate their time here.  Get a life so to speak.

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If someone wants to spend 10 hours or more a day on the Community, that's fine by me if the person can find the time to do that. But the nonsense posts are a serious problem.  I'm not talking about a thread where there's some socializing going on in a few messages. That's going to happen. 

I'm speaking of the deliberate nonsense that has clearly been going on with some members going in and either giving silly answers that have nothing to do with the topic of a thread, or repeating an answer from 12 hours, 3 days, or 6 months ago just to get to some arbritary 50 or 100 message per day or week post count quota.  I fully realize that some repitition happens by accident (a member might not have seen a previous message, or a message is posted a few minutes after the previous person says the same thing), but there are some who are clearly doing it on purpose based the rate at which this occurs with some.

I believe that the post count aspect of the Community reward secret forumula needs to be tweaked/de-emphasized. The quality of message posts in the Community needs to increase, not the amount of messages posted.

[will13am]

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@srlawren wrote:

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@will13am wrote:

How do you police this kind of nonsense?  No amount of post movements and categorization will fix it.  What people need to do is take stock of the effort they put in against the potential rewards they get out of it and recalibrate their time here.  Get a life so to speak.

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@will13am I've said it before and I'll say it again:  there's an easy solution--stop giving out communtiy rewards.  Once that happens, the people that are actually in it to help will continue to do so, the people looking to make a quick buck will head to greener pastures, and the communtiy will be way better for it as a result.  I know that I'm in the minority with this opinion, but I really do think it would be for the best after the dust and outrage settled.

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To Public Mobile, this is a marketing schtick.  They are not going to get rid of it just because people game the system.  They will manage it instead.  

[darlicious]

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@will13am wrote:

@darlicious , TL;DR.  I am going to say the community at large is at fault, no specific finger pointing but guilt is not evenly spread of course.  When I joined the community forum 3 years ago, it was not nearly as active as today.  It has become a competition for the tiny amount of community rewards to the point that the waste of human capital is just astonishing.  Yet, people want that glory to be on the top of the leaderboard.  They are willing to camp here 18 hours a day and take short cuts like make multiple accounts and do self promotion to get there.  When there is nothing to respond to, people will continue to discuss existing and old threads to page 5 just to keep the post count up! 

How do you police this kind of nonsense?  No amount of post movements and categorization will fix it.  What people need to do is take stock of the effort they put in against the potential rewards they get out of it and recalibrate their time here.  Get a life so to speak.

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@will13am  Yes I certainly see your point. I may spend more time here than I should but it often comprises more reading than anything else. I don't feel the need to comment or post when the solution has been made or it offers no value to the OP. Unfortunately some members do try to game the system or just post for post count. But i have noticed the direct correlation that the quality of post far outweighs the value of post and bravo count so that those who make the community reward decisions have that issue fully under control. Time wasted skimming thru posts  of poor value is irritating but are rewarded by the informative or more thought provoking ones. Given that many times I'm online at off peak times it can be disappointing to not have any one to help when that is my intention...maybe just for the good  Samaritan endorphins    

my brain is seeking is far more of the addiction than the rewards others may want.

[srlawren]

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@will13am wrote:

How do you police this kind of nonsense?  No amount of post movements and categorization will fix it.  What people need to do is take stock of the effort they put in against the potential rewards they get out of it and recalibrate their time here.  Get a life so to speak.

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@will13am I've said it before and I'll say it again:  there's an easy solution--stop giving out communtiy rewards.  Once that happens, the people that are actually in it to help will continue to do so, the people looking to make a quick buck will head to greener pastures, and the communtiy will be way better for it as a result.  I know that I'm in the minority with this opinion, but I really do think it would be for the best after the dust and outrage settled.

[will13am]

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@Anonymous wrote:

The question is...would those topics be bravo and solution worthy and therefor be of benefit for those participating? I don't imagine they'd want to get into devaluing participation in your category like zero (the lounge) < category < forum. That would just be too much admin to bother with I would think.

The Oracles and mods are always looking out for those people that try to "game" the system for their benefit. will13am even had a suspicion of that possible activity earlier today.

This is part of why The Lounge was created. As far as we know, activity there doesn't count towards any benefit. Certainly bravo's. There's no solution button anyway.

The idea has already been floated that maybe the blurb for Discussions could say something else. Maybe Discussions should just be removed altogether.

I personally don't care about threads wandering off topic. The OP might of course with the default email notifications filling their inbox. But whatever. They can turn that off.

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If OP asks a question, etiquette would suggest they be given some breathing space to figure out what to do with the suggestion.  The gaming is obvious when various people will post on and on ad nauseam, some adding a bit of value while others would just say what s/he said.  

[darlicious]

@Anonymous  I don't mind the off topic wandering myself but @Tiana_V  had asked earlier this month myself and @ShawnC13  when we wandered of topic to stick to the topic at hand. Since then @ShawnC13  has taken it upon himself to ensure this new directive is followed so finding a solution to this issue seems to have become more important than perhaps it has been in the past.

[will13am]

@darlicious , TL;DR.  I am going to say the community at large is at fault, no specific finger pointing but guilt is not evenly spread of course.  When I joined the community forum 3 years ago, it was not nearly as active as today.  It has become a competition for the tiny amount of community rewards to the point that the waste of human capital is just astonishing.  Yet, people want that glory to be on the top of the leaderboard.  They are willing to camp here 18 hours a day and take short cuts like make multiple accounts and do self promotion to get there.  When there is nothing to respond to, people will continue to discuss existing and old threads to page 5 just to keep the post count up! 

How do you police this kind of nonsense?  No amount of post movements and categorization will fix it.  What people need to do is take stock of the effort they put in against the potential rewards they get out of it and recalibrate their time here.  Get a life so to speak.

[Anonymous]

The question is...would those topics be bravo and solution worthy and therefor be of benefit for those participating? I don't imagine they'd want to get into devaluing participation in your category like zero (the lounge) < category < forum. That would just be too much admin to bother with I would think.

The Oracles and mods are always looking out for those people that try to "game" the system for their benefit. will13am even had a suspicion of that possible activity earlier today.

This is part of why The Lounge was created. As far as we know, activity there doesn't count towards any benefit. Certainly bravo's. There's no solution button anyway.

The idea has already been floated that maybe the blurb for Discussions could say something else. Maybe Discussions should just be removed altogether.

I personally don't care about threads wandering off topic. The OP might of course with the default email notifications filling their inbox. But whatever. They can turn that off.