topic Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted?? in Get Support

Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

michaelc9181 — Wed, 05 Jan 2022 07:37:53 GMT

My phone was blacklisted by Telus/PM yesterday as the previous owner had a delinquent account. Luckily, Orchard is working with Telus to resolve this on my behalf asap (yay customer service!)

Im a bit uncomfortable by the response I got from PM....they first said it was my phone that was the issue and to contact Apple. Next, they said that I was blacklisted but not by Public Mobile and no form of resolution was provided. When I confirmed that it was PM/Telus that blocked my phon they did offer to adjust my plan, however, they refused my request to have this looked into by a supervisor.

I was wondering if this has happened to anyone else? What kind of resolution did you receive? How long were you without service? Should I be escalating to the CCTS?

Thanks,

Michael

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

Luddite — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 19:23:02 GMT

Yes, I can see this situation happening. As to who is accountable, I would say Orchard since they were selling the phone as unlocked and ready for service.

This situation has also arisen when the original seller of a used phone reports it stolen to make an insurance claim.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

MarieHelene_L — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 19:45:08 GMT

Hey @michaelc9181,

We don't have any supervisor that we can transfer cases to. If we need a supervisor's input, we will verbally ask for it and continue dealing with the customer ourselves.

I'm just learning now that the device was blacklisted due to the previous owner's account. I understand that this is completely not your fault, however as @Luddite mentioned, I don't think PM should be help accountable for this situation.

Orchard should've provided you with a phone that was ready to be used, if they can't have it unblacklisted, I personally think they should provide you with a replacement phone. That's something you'll have to see with them 🙂

Regardless, as I've mentioned, simply get back to us once your services are functional and we'll make sure to adjust your plan to make up for the lost days 🙂

Marie

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

michaelc9181 — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 19:44:04 GMT

I understand your point, but I totally disagree! The blacklist was introduced as a means to counteract theft. I don't think PM/Telus should be using the blacklist as a means to punish delinquent accounts as situations like this can arise.

Regardless, I really appreciate your assistace @MarieHelene_L. I hope that in the future Public Mobile can develop their dispute resolution process to allow for a better customer experience/open dialogue. For ex. having an escalations team or allowing supervisors to talk to customers...

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

will13am — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 19:49:41 GMT

@michaelc9181, I read about this all the time online. It is the biggest scam going. People would get a free phone on contract, sell the phone, skip out on the contract and have the phone buyer stuck with a brick. This action has got nothing to do with Public Mobile. After all they don't sell hardware. As for Telus blacklisting a phone that was sourced through them for breach of contract, you could try arguing through the CCTS. To some degree, they have certain rights to that hardware as it is associated with the breached contract. They have no obligation to you whatsoever. My policy is to never buy carrier phones, not from the source and certainly not from a third party. It is rather interesting that even Orchard gets caught in these schemes.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

michaelc9181 — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 19:58:00 GMT

@will13am I was suprised as well! Orchard has offered me a replacement or a full refund for the phone as expected. I'm definitley leaning toward the latter option...

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

mimmo — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 19:59:46 GMT

Can this happen with all phones (android and apple)?

Just curious how it works.

I buy phone off craigslist.

check blacklist no issues

start using phone.

old owner can then claim lost phone
carrier can blacklist phone if original owner doesnt payoff their account

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

RLBL — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 20:05:39 GMT

@mimmo

Although money can be saved buying a 2nd hand phone, I never will for this very reason.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

will13am — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 20:20:46 GMT

@mimmo wrote:
Can this happen with all phones (android and apple)?

Just curious how it works.

I buy phone off craigslist.
check blacklist no issues
start using phone.

old owner can then claim lost phone
carrier can blacklist phone if original owner doesnt payoff their account

This kind of thing can happen to any brand of phone. All phones have a unique IMEI that is assigned by the manufacturer. This is what is registered into the blacklist database.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

skmkenn — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 20:22:52 GMT

@mimmo wrote:
Can this happen with all phones (android and apple)?

Just curious how it works.

I buy phone off craigslist.
check blacklist no issues
start using phone.

old owner can then claim lost phone
carrier can blacklist phone if original owner doesnt payoff their account

Yes, it doesn't matter what type of device it is as the blacklist is based on the IMEI. I've seen a few cases of this in the past, and it's usually related to fraud in some way (for example, someone obtained a phone on a contract using false identification and then sells the phone, skips out on the account and it gets flagged as fraudulent).

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

MarieHelene_L — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 20:23:47 GMT

I myself found a used iPhone 6 from Kijiji about 1-2 years ago, mint condition, only a few months of use and decently priced!

Check IMEI and it's not blacklisted, everything looks good so I go ahead and meet with the owner to buy the phone! The phone is locked to Videotron so I contact them to have it unlocked, and they inform me that they cannot / will not unlock it because the previous owner had an outstanding bill of something like 3000$ to pay.

It could be worse - at least my phone isn't blacklisted and I can use it without any problem! It's just somewhat of a pain for the traveler that I am... Oh well, no 2nd hand phones for me anymore!

And yes @mimmo, that's pretty much how it would go! It can happen to any type of phones 🙂

Marie

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

stonechucker — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 20:28:23 GMT

Wow... makes me wonder why people do these things. It has not happened to me (yet?) and hopefully never will.

In my one experience with a previously owned device, I purchased it via Wind on there pre-loved iPhone 5S intro. Told it was a refurbish device, and other than the cheap lightning cord, charging block, and knock off earpods, it was great.

I have since sold this device, without accessories, slightly damaged to a coworker, as we came to an agreed price based on the condition of the device, and the lack of accessories. We finalized the deal after he was satisfied it was no longer connected in any fashion to my various accounts, nor listed as a device associated with my iCloud/Apple management, or other such things.

i know I'm not going to report it stolen, and my coworker is thrilled to have a newer model iPhone than his previous device. He was also able to purchase the required accessories brand new, as it doesn't make sense to use previous used EarPods, and shotty cables and charging bricks.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

skmkenn — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 20:35:14 GMT

@stonechucker One of the most common reasons that this happens is because there are scammers who will buy a phone at low cost (or for free) on a contract, turn around and sell it for near retail price (in turn making a profit), and then report the device as lost or stolen (which then causes the IMEI of the original device to be blacklisted, turning it into a brick) and obtainining a new device through device protection plans. They wind up with a brand new phone and several hundred dollars in their pocket in the process.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

stonechucker — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 20:39:01 GMT

@skmkenn, again wow! I'm not wired that way. I just don't understand why someone can think this is ok. I'm surprised they don't think about getting caught.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

PBForMe — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 21:55:10 GMT

Very surprising, considering PM directly advertises Orchard as a place to buy phones that work on PM, I believe they do indeed share some accountability here.

If phones from Orchard can still be blacklisted on PM then they shouldn't be advertised on the site as a place to buy phones from.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

echf — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 22:45:59 GMT

Unfortunately, other carrier can't alter a phone's status in the database.

Any issue need to solve through the one who filed the blacklist.

You can treat the IMEI blacklist database as read-only.

PM really can't do much about it.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

will13am — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 22:50:40 GMT

@PBForMe wrote:
Very surprising, considering PM directly advertises Orchard as a place to buy phones that work on PM, I believe they do indeed share some accountability here.

If phones from Orchard can still be blacklisted on PM then they shouldn't be advertised on the site as a place to buy phones from.

This is the nature of the beast for resale items, caveat emptor. I am sure that Orchard does a ton of due diligence, likely way more than the typical retail buyer. If they can be victims of fraud, imagine the exposure that a retail buyer faces. Like a broken record, I will repeatedly say avoid carrier devices, particular resale ones.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

srlawren — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 22:52:51 GMT

@RLBL wrote:
@mimmo

Although money can be saved buying a 2nd hand phone, I never will for this very reason.

@RLBL agreed, 100%. Unless it's from someone I know and trust. I did buy a used BB Curve 3300 off Craigslist years ago and was lucky enough not to have any issue, but I doubt I'd ever risk it again.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

will13am — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 22:53:04 GMT

@MarieHelene_L wrote:
I myself found a used iPhone 6 from Kijiji about 1-2 years ago, mint condition, only a few months of use and decently priced!

Check IMEI and it's not blacklisted, everything looks good so I go ahead and meet with the owner to buy the phone! The phone is locked to Videotron so I contact them to have it unlocked, and they inform me that they cannot / will not unlock it because the previous owner had an outstanding bill of something like 3000$ to pay.

It could be worse - at least my phone isn't blacklisted and I can use it without any problem! It's just somewhat of a pain for the traveler that I am... Oh well, no 2nd hand phones for me anymore!

And yes @mimmo, that's pretty much how it would go! It can happen to any type of phones 🙂

Marie

Count yourself lucky that Videotron doesn't use the blacklist system in situations like this. They could easily have taken the Telus route.

Re: Has anyone else been unfairly blacklisted??

Michael77 — Mon, 14 Aug 2017 03:24:00 GMT

Interesting...... Thanks guys for educating me. I had no idea this kind of stuff happens. I must be living in a dream world. 🙂